GDG- Re: secession

[Margaret D. Blough]

>>Bottom line to me - if the nation was founded as government of, by and for  
the people and if it was stated in one of the founding documents that the  
government ruled only with the consent of the people that elected it and if that  
consent was withdrawn by the people, all points against secession are  moot.  
Otherwise, this whole experiment has been one giant fraud!   That was what 
motivated the Confederates.<<

Hardly.  Prior to the Revolution, Americans had no say in the laws that governed them and the leaders who led them.  The Revolution and the Constitution changed that forever.  The Constitution, particularly the Bill of Rights, protected the rights of minorities but did not give them a veto over majority decisions.  Andrew Jackson, as President, rejected the theory of nullification and threatened to hang nullificationists if they defied lawful federal authoirty.  All that happened in 1860 was that the lawful election of a president of the United States occurred (a result, by the way, that owed a lot to secessionist efforts to sabotage the Democratic Party to ensure such a result so as to justify their actions.)  One of the most basic principles of the Constitutional government of the United States is that the loser accept that result and concentrate on efforts to win at the polls in the future.  That is why the election of 1800 was such a defining moment in United States history.  
 
>>No one seems to mind that western Virginia seceded from Virginia - and if  
that was the will of those people then so be it!  If the people of eastern  
Tennessee had done the same, then so be it (they were almost the state of  
Franklin long ago by the way).<<

Actually, Western Virginia did not secede from Virginia. When the elected officials of Virginia broke their oath to support the Constitution of the United States, a provisional government of Virginia was recognized as that state's government by the United States government. (Something similar happened with occupied countries in WW II which established governments-in-exile). It was that provisional government that gave the necessary Constitutional assent to the division.  The Confederate government no more accepted this than it did East Tennessee's attempts and embarked on military efforts to suppress both (the West Virginia effort, at one point, was led by Robert E. Lee himself, not his finest moment). The Franklin example, BTW, is a particularly poor one. During the antebellum period, so long as the government of Tennessee did not assent to it, Franklin had no constitutional chance of recognition.  The only reason that West Virginia was able to establish a more formal structure an
d throw off the efforts of Richmond to regain control and East Tennessee was not was that West Virginia had two free states on its borders from which Union help could readily come.  East Tennessee was not so fortunate and the uprising there was brutally suppressed with rebels facing either execution or exile.

Regards,

Margaret


-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: Biggsk at aol.com 

> Esteemed GDG Member Contributes: 
> 
> 
> Margaret writes: 
> 
> >>>Relying on an absence of an express prohibition is a decidedly weak reed 
> to rely on. Yes, there were some who believed secession was legal but there 
> were many who did not. Even Jefferson accepted that no nation is obligated 
> to commit suicide.>>> 
> Not really - especially in Jacksonian America where people basically felt 
> that if it wasn't written down saying otherwise it was doable. I realize that 
> some believed it was legal and some did not and the Federal courts certainly 
> never tackled it so far as I am aware leaving it an open question. 
> 
> And yet today there's secession in America when towns vote to secede from 
> counties as did Sandy Springs, GA a couple years ago leaving behind Fulton 
> County and becoming a separate city after years of trying. The Fulton County 
> sheriffs nor the Georgia National Guard mobilized forces to put down this 
> heinous rebellion of citizens who committed treason against Fulton County by the 
> actions of their public plebiscite. It was the will of the people to become a 
> separate city as the public services of the county were not as good as what a 
> city could provide them (long story about their tax dollars being taken and 
> getting next to nothing back for them). We see/hear of similar situations 
> across the nation. 
> 
> Bottom line to me - if the nation was founded as government of, by and for 
> the people and if it was stated in one of the founding documents that the 
> government ruled only with the consent of the people that elected it and if that 
> consent was withdrawn by the people, all points against secession are moot. 
> Otherwise, this whole experiment has been one giant fraud! That was what 
> motivated the Confederates. 
> 
> No one seems to mind that western Virginia seceded from Virginia - and if 
> that was the will of those people then so be it! If the people of eastern 
> Tennessee had done the same, then so be it (they were almost the state of 
> Franklin long ago by the way). 
> 
> Greg Biggs 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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